The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

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The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by Ellandback1 » Mon May 18, 2020 7:50 am



Good Morning, It's Monday 18th May, and here are the latest headlines from Elland Road...


EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

The EFL released a statement on Friday, the EFL said it will use an unweighted points per game model to calculate final standings for any division which cannot complete the season. The statement read...

In the event of a curtailment of the season, the EFL board outlined how this could be addressed through a framework that includes maintaining the principle of promotion and relegation, league tables to be determined via unweighted points per game (PPG) and play-offs to remain in every division to determine the final promotion place.

Leeds would finish Champions with an average of 1.92 points per game with West Brom just behind them on 1.89. The play offs contenders would be Fulham (1.73), Brentford (1.62), Nottingham Forest (1.62) and Preston North End (1.51) points. The EFL Statement was released following all 24 clubs from League Two voting unanimously for the season to end, three clubs to be promoted automatically, play-offs to take place normally but no relegation into the National League.

Stevenage sit at the foot of the Football league with 22 points, but with a game in hand over Macclesfield on 25 points. FA Chairman Greg Clarke told the Premier League last week that they would block any moves to declare seasons null and void. Whilst its sad news for Graham Westley's side, the FA will surely need to follow through on their promise throughout all 91 League Clubs. Stevenage could of course use the excuse that as Bury were expelled from the Football League, they should be allowed to stay to balance the numbers, but would this give Premier League teams at the foot of the Premier League ammunition?





Championship teams set to vote

Championship and League One Clubs are set to vote this week on whether to resume the 2019/20 season. Due to the massive additional costs of testing players, it’s likely that only the Championship will restart. This will see Coventry and Rotherham return to the second tier with Oxford Utd, Portsmouth, Fleetwood Town and Peterborough contest the play offs. This will be harsh on Sunderland and Wycombe Wanderers who miss out on the plays on goal difference.

There is a suggestion that parachute payments to relegated clubs could be extended to those going down into League One, League Two and the National League to soften the blow of going down. Training must resume in the next seven days if there is any chance that FA Chairman Greg Clarke's guidelines that the season must be conclude by 30th June are met. This date coincides with out of contract players being released from their contractual obligations.





Is it too soon?

Yesterday we witnessed first hand what would happen if football is bought back too soon. Two unidentified players from the Hannover v Dresden fixture tested positive to the coronavirus. Although the duo didn't have any symptoms, the entire team including coaching and support staff face quarantine for 14 days. How could this affect the he Premiership / Championship? Wayne Rooney certainly thinks it is! The Derby County and former Manchester United forward told the Sunday Times...

I'm desperate to train and play again, but it feels like football in England is being pushed to return too soon. Our government says people can return to work, but only with social distancing in the workplace and that does not work in football. So I don't get it, until the government gives the green light to have physical contact, we can't train or prepare properly.

I understand where Troy Deeney, Danny Rose and Raheem Sterling are coming from. The concern is not so much for ourselves, like whether you might pick up an injury, but more about bringing coronavirus home and infecting those around us. People's lives are at risk.


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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May)

Post by HarryofOz » Mon May 18, 2020 8:11 am

While my preference would be to finish the season, I certainly won't be complaining too loudly.

But I'm sure other clubs and their fans will - and you can understand their point of view.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by faaip » Mon May 18, 2020 9:28 am

It'll be a farce to name us champions if we don't kick a ball again, we're a point ahead with 9 to go...joint champions at best imo and I'm not sure Fulham were out of the race...
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by BGwhite » Mon May 18, 2020 9:38 am

It is what it is but no one can deny we are the best team in the division by a long way and that's with a non functioning goal scorer.


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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by weasel » Mon May 18, 2020 9:59 am

BGwhite wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 9:38 am
It is what it is but no one can deny we are the best team in the division by a long way


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That's the crux of the argument against what those bellends from Norwich and Brighton are saying about not promoting a team unless the season is finished. If the season isn't finished then you have to promote the most deserving and that is the teams in the top 2 position as they are comfortably clear. You can make arguments about collapses, teams going on great runs etc but that is all just guesswork rather than basing it on the evidence currently at hand. Teams deserve to get relegated and teams deserve to get promoted and if seasons aren't played to a finish it doesn't alter the fact that 75% of a season has been played teams are where they are at this point because they deserve to be and it is far more likely that teams would continue on their current trajectory rather than deviate wildly. Yes when there is just a point or two difference then it is more open to change (as we saw last year). Teams only have themselves to blame if they are not in a better position at this point than they'd like to be, nobody else played the matches for them, lost or won for them etc.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by 1964white » Mon May 18, 2020 10:04 am

faaip wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 9:28 am
It'll be a farce to name us champions if we don't kick a ball again, we're a point ahead with 9 to go...joint champions at best imo and I'm not sure Fulham were out of the race...
Fulham would have been after we'd battered them at ER

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by 1964white » Mon May 18, 2020 10:05 am

weasel wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 9:59 am
That's the crux of the argument against what those bellends from Norwich and Brighton are saying about not promoting a team unless the season is finished. If the season isn't finished then you have to promote the most deserving and that is the teams in the top 2 position as they are comfortably clear. You can make arguments about collapses, teams going on great runs etc but that is all just guesswork rather than basing it on the evidence currently at hand. Teams deserve to get relegated and teams deserve to get promoted and if seasons aren't played to a finish it doesn't alter the fact that 75% of a season has been played teams are where they are at this point because they deserve to be and it is far more likely that teams would continue on their current trajectory rather than deviate wildly. Yes when there is just a point or two difference then it is more open to change (as we saw last year). Teams only have themselves to blame if they are not in a better position at this point than they'd like to be, nobody else played the matches for them, lost or won for them etc.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May)

Post by 1964white » Mon May 18, 2020 10:11 am

HarryofOz wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 8:11 am
While my preference would be to finish the season, I certainly won't be complaining too loudly.

But I'm sure other clubs and their fans will - and you can understand their point of view.
As I've said previously Harry I don't mind how we go up as we are the best team in the championship by a distance. We were on a terrific run of form & unfortunately denied our opportunity to become worthy champions. No way were the wheels going to fall off this time!

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by faaip » Mon May 18, 2020 10:31 am

weasel wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 9:59 am
That's the crux of the argument against what those bellends from Norwich and Brighton are saying about not promoting a team unless the season is finished. If the season isn't finished then you have to promote the most deserving and that is the teams in the top 2 position as they are comfortably clear. You can make arguments about collapses, teams going on great runs etc but that is all just guesswork rather than basing it on the evidence currently at hand. Teams deserve to get relegated and teams deserve to get promoted and if seasons aren't played to a finish it doesn't alter the fact that 75% of a season has been played teams are where they are at this point because they deserve to be and it is far more likely that teams would continue on their current trajectory rather than deviate wildly. Yes when there is just a point or two difference then it is more open to change (as we saw last year). Teams only have themselves to blame if they are not in a better position at this point than they'd like to be, nobody else played the matches for them, lost or won for them etc.
You know that's rubbish right, if it were true we could just not play the final 25 % of any season as it's set in stone that the positions then will be the positions had the season been carried on...And that's clearly as false as a flat earth
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by WhiteRose » Mon May 18, 2020 10:42 am

It's all just wild speculation at the moment coming from all corners. The EFL have no say over what happens with the PL and with the bottom clubs getting increasingly desperate I am sure they will find a way to remain in the league at our expense. Its an unfortunate turn of events and one that will impact Leeds more than most but we are all used to it.

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May)

Post by Ellandback1 » Mon May 18, 2020 10:44 am

HarryofOz wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 8:11 am
While my preference would be to finish the season, I certainly won't be complaining too loudly.

But I'm sure other clubs and their fans will - and you can understand their point of view.
But it would be nice for the FA /EFL/UEFA to actually side with Leeds for the first time in their existence.

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by weasel » Mon May 18, 2020 10:55 am

I didn't say that positions were set in stone and obviously wild fluxations can happen. However no one can say that a team that has averaged less than 2 points a game is definitely going to suddenly win 7 or 8 out of 9 matches. They might just as easily lose 7 or 8 out of 9 although more probable is that they won't deviate far from their overall form for the season. If the season cannot be finished, I would prefer it to finish even if we crashed, then you have to say that the teams deserve to be in the places they currently occupy. If they are supposedly capable of winning 7 or 8 out of 9 then what were they waiting for?

I think last year was the first time in the history of the Championship that a team top at Christmas hadn't got promoted. That suggests that Leeds crashing and burning was a freak occurrence than the normal so in every other year the normal played out rather than the freak occurrence. So if the season doesn't play out is an event that happened once in what 27 times more likely to happen than the event that happened 26 times in 27?
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by faaip » Mon May 18, 2020 11:04 am

I objected to the "Teams only have themselves to blame if they are not in a better position at this point" ..it's simply not true and we've seen all kind of final day relegation escapes and promotion pushes ..Where were Reading after three quarters of the season? The season they went on that run to get in the playoffs from nowhere. You cannot predict a football league at any time...And we do have a recent history of finishing a season poorly after fast starts, Under Monk, TC/Heck and under Bielsa, we also lost a big lead already this season.

I mean end the season early and LUFC probably go up in 18/19...win more titles under Revie. The season is the season (all of it, not just selected bits) taking 25% off yields a different table altogether.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by TatleyK » Mon May 18, 2020 11:35 am

faaip wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 11:04 am
I objected to the "Teams only have themselves to blame if they are not in a better position at this point" ..it's simply not true and we've seen all kind of final day relegation escapes and promotion pushes ..Where were Reading after three quarters of the season? The season they went on that run to get in the playoffs from nowhere. You cannot predict a football league at any time...And we do have a recent history of finishing a season poorly after fast starts, Under Monk, TC/Heck and under Bielsa, we also lost a big lead already this season.

I mean end the season early and LUFC probably go up in 18/19...win more titles under Revie. The season is the season (all of it, not just selected bits) taking 25% off yields a different table altogether.
The problem is this is not a normal situation. It looks increasingly likely that the season will not be finished. So is it better to come up with a solution to recognise what has happened for over 75% of the season, or just say that nothing that has happened in the previous 9 months has any merit? As someone who has invested a lot of time and money into the season, I for one would be furious if it is decided that this season didn’t happen. The best solution is obviously to finish the season, but even that won’t be welcomed by some clubs (especially in the premier league who seem to be trying to find any excuse to work the situation to their own advantage). If the season cannot be concluded then current (or projected positions) must be recognised. I know this will work in our favour, but I would feel the same if we were in the bottom 3.

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by faaip » Mon May 18, 2020 11:43 am

I'm ok with getting lucky regarding promotion but to call us Champions is completely wrong imo..I'd imagine Bielsa would feel the same way.

If we were bottom 3-5 then I'd also be complaining about an unfinished season..as I know there would have been every chance to affect an escape. I think it's very easy to say you'd be ok with it knowing that we're not in that position.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by weasel » Mon May 18, 2020 12:28 pm

But it is the freak occurrences rather than the norm. The Reading situation was a one off, the other 26 times it doesn't happen. So it is less than 4% likely to happen. There will always be twists and turns but like I keep saying if the season was to end now you can't base a table on what ifs as every team in the league could argue they were about to go on a 9 game winning run and nobody is going to say relegate us cos we were going to slip from mid-table to relegation as we were about to lose 9 in a row. Teams are where they are because of how they have done so far this season, not on how well they might do. They have lost matches they didn't deserve to, won matches they didn't deserve to etc but ultimately they are where they are now because they deserve to be there. It isn't like any team has thought lets play reasonably sh*t all season then blow the league away in the last 9 matches.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by TatleyK » Mon May 18, 2020 12:31 pm

faaip wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 11:43 am
I'm ok with getting lucky regarding promotion but to call us Champions is completely wrong imo..I'd imagine Bielsa would feel the same way.

If we were bottom 3-5 then I'd also be complaining about an unfinished season..as I know there would have been every chance to affect an escape. I think it's very easy to say you'd be ok with it knowing that we're not in that position.
Of course it’s easy to think that, but I genuinely would. If we’d been bad enough to be in that position, as much as I would love any excuse to save us, I would have to face up to the fact that these are extreme circumstances and there have to be winners and losers. What is your solution?

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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by faaip » Mon May 18, 2020 12:43 pm

Well I bloody wouldn't...what if we were 4 unbeaten and there was a team just above us that had lost 6 on the spin...Actually there's so many what if's that that's one of the reasons it's an unfair system ...
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by TatleyK » Mon May 18, 2020 12:50 pm

weasel wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 12:28 pm
But it is the freak occurrences rather than the norm. The Reading situation was a one off, the other 26 times it doesn't happen. So it is less than 4% likely to happen. There will always be twists and turns but like I keep saying if the season was to end now you can't base a table on what ifs as every team in the league could argue they were about to go on a 9 game winning run and nobody is going to say relegate us cos we were going to slip from mid-table to relegation as we were about to lose 9 in a row. Teams are where they are because of how they have done so far this season, not on how well they might do. They have lost matches they didn't deserve to, won matches they didn't deserve to etc but ultimately they are where they are now because they deserve to be there. It isn't like any team has thought lets play reasonably sh*t all season then blow the league away in the last 9 matches.
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Re: The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Mon 18th May) - EFL Statement delights Leeds fans

Post by TatleyK » Mon May 18, 2020 12:53 pm

faaip wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 12:43 pm
Well I bloody wouldn't...what if we were 4 unbeaten and there was a team just above us that had lost 6 on the spin...Actually there's so many what if's that that's one of the reasons it's an unfair system ...
So what is fair? What is your solution?

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