Whats gone wrong . .

[Byebyegeegee]

Yes Cjay I’ve said much the same thing on another thread regarding the sometimes baffling square peg policy, in fact here it is:


I must admit that for the first time since Bielsa joined I am on the verge of being critical of him.

Like others have pointed out I fail to see why he plays Dan James as centre forward when Gelhardt has proved recently that he would be up to the task. Why he has Phillips at cb instead of dm then takes him off at half time and puts Struijk (a cb) at dm. Why, instead of playing Drameh, a specialist right back, he prefers to put Llorente (a cb) there 1st half, then Shackleton a midfielder there for the 2nd half.

Our personnel and team positions seem to be all over the place at the moment, which might be something to do with injuries, but we still have back up specialists for each position who imo are not being utilised properly.

You could argue that Bielsa’s square peg in round hole strategy has more or less worked up to now but there will come a point where this strategy, combined with a touch of belligerence and “I know best” arrogance, fails and judging by yesterday’s game and tbh most of this season so far, that point may have been reached.

If I, as one of Bielsa’s staunchest supporters, am on the verge then you just know that the situation is becoming serious. I still have faith that he and the team can turn things around but we need to see some signs soon. 6pts from the next two matches would be handy before the real onslaught of 4 or so really tough games where no points at all wouldn’t be a surprise.

I am certainly not advocating for a change of Manager yet but….


As I’ve inferred above the next 2 home games against potential relegation rivals will be crucial to our season, if we don’t get maximum points from these then we could potentially go 6 or 7 games without a win, without a point, and given that scenario the whole season may be lost. I think we’ll know by the new year whether our season can be saved.

[VinnysTattoo]

I think the choice to play James in the number 9 role yesterday is a perfect example of what’s going wrong. Gelhardt must be as baffled as we are. Strange decisions like this must affect the players, and not in a good way.

It also seems to me the players are losing faith in the system. It feels that the team togetherness has been lost.

I obviously hope we get back to last seasons levels but I can’t see it happening. Maybe we just need a couple of wins on the bounce to lose the fear factor we seem to have at the moment.

[Scoobychief]

We've got a winger in James with bags of pace. But yet he couldn't pass an old lady with a zimmer frame

[White Riot]

This season?

I have my own theories but what do we all think?

On the evidence so far we have looked completely out of sorts. Nobody is saying how difficult it is to play Leeds anymore, they're just licking their lips at the prospect of taking three points off us.

Injuries havent helped but we have had injury problems since Bielsa arrived, we have coped before so i dont think that can be the primary reason.

Injuries is a factor, but all teams have injuries. We had virtually a full team available yesterday and it was still dire.

The team seems flat, the running stats are still high but those can be misleading (if your man runs off you and then you chase him but dont catch him your running stats would look good).

I don't think we're out running teams anymore. We look knackered most of the time.

What has happened to our slick passing? We resorted to hoof ball second half (68% passing accuracy)

We've lost confidence, and are likely to become more hesitant and "safe" as the pressure grows. If you're hoofing the ball up to Harrison, James, Rodrigo and Raphinha, then what are you expecting? None of them are the rough, physical types.

We arent creating chances like previous seasons.

No, passing is crap and that kills things for starters. When we get in reasonable positions we're overcome by hesitancy, or make the wrong choices.

We arent pressing

That's for sure. Most teams are out pressing us. So another of our strengths ahs disappeared.

We arent controlling games.

No we aren't, but if you keep passing the ball out of play, or to the opposition, you're not gonna.

But why? Lack of confidence and composure, which will further deteriorate unless we start getting some wins.

Clearly something is wrong but what is it?
It's a combination of things:
Bielsa's insistence on putting square pegs in round holes.
A lack of quality.
No fresh ideas.
Lack of composure
Lack of confidence.
Knackered players that have been run into the ground
Confusion about their roles as they're in unfamiliar positions
A lack of grit and determination to win
We've lost impetus

Is it purely injuries or is it deeper?

It's way deeper than just injuries. We have looked out of sorts since pre-season. We needed to refresh this squad and that hasn't happened.

And more importantly do you trust Bielsa to fix it? Be honest, saying no doesnt mean you want him sacked just hand on heart do you feel he can fix it now?
In the past I've always felt he could fix it. But when he's doing daft things like playing people out of position, it's just generating instability and indecision in the players minds and we're getting clobbered because of it.
The one position that we did address in the summer, with Firpo, looks even weaker than last season
How can a top coach continually field a team that has a gaping void in midfield?
I sincerely hope he can fix things, but 13 matches in and I'm not convinced that he can.

Finally is this season something that the club should have seen coming?
Yes, but I think they were counting on Bielsa's ability to work miracles, which seems to have run dry.
How they have still not recruited an ACM since Saiz left is astounding. We've spent a lot of dosh on Costa, Rodrigo, James, Harrison, etc, but we didn't deem it prudent to buy an ACM to fill our attacking void
That is mental, and we're paying the price for that and other decisions that have not worked out.

[White Riot]

I think the choice to play James in the number 9 role yesterday is a perfect example of what’s going wrong. Gelhardt must be as baffled as we are. Strange decisions like this must affect the players, and not in a good way.

It also seems to me the players are losing faith in the system. It feels that the team togetherness has been lost.

I obviously hope we get back to last seasons levels but I can’t see it happening. Maybe we just need a couple of wins on the bounce to lose the fear factor we seem to have at the moment.

Agree mate, this tinkering about is not working and also causing damage to the confidence of the players as individuals and the team's morale.

[White Riot]

We've got a winger in James with bags of pace. But yet he couldn't pass an old lady with a zimmer frame

But look at how Lamptey showed how to do it against Firpo

[Chilli D]

Because he would prefer to use a senior player over a younger one, he said as much in a press conference.

It's strange because obviously he used Gelhardt then dropped him, doesn't send a great message to Joe and other youngsters?

Not only that, he bigged Gelhardt up in the press conference and then drops him and as you point out, he doesn't get a single minute on the pitch.
That to me was the most baffling thing yesterday.

[Musicman1965]

In my opinion its all down to the small squad of players that are out of position and expected to go up against opposition that have quality players. Key areas have not been covered sufficiently and this has hurt our overall game. Its no use having 70% of the play if you can't get a shot on target. I expect MB will continue to the end on this season and Leeds to finish in the bottom half of the table.

[weasel]

Injuries pure and simple is the root cause. It then leads on to other things.

An example of this was when Ayling used to get switched to centreback when we had a centreback injured. We then looked poor but it wasn't due to Ayling being the square peg it was that we didn't have someone playing Ayling's position to the same level that he was. As such the square peg thing was an issue, or lack of squad depth depending on your viewpoint, but without the injury the other factors don't come into play.

So fast forward to this season and Ayling is injured. Shackleton and others have done okay but not as well as Ayling has done there. As such our ability to turn defence into attack as quickly is hindered greatly which means we don't look as good as we aren't hitting teams quickly which means space isn't opening up as quickly. It also means the opposition can push up higher limiting our space making it more likely that we give the ball away. So one key injury makes a huge difference. Additionally for all his critics Alioski was doing a decent job on the other side too.

You then throw in Bamford's absence. Whilst Bamford has his critics I don't think even his harshest critics would criticise his work rate. The work rate is key. In pressurising the opposition when they have the ball it makes it more likely that they will have to resort to playing it out quicker and increasing their chance of losing possession. When we have the ball he also knows what position to be in for the build up play. He is a great foil for the wingers and an outlet for any longball. It sometimes leads to him not being in the box at the end of a move but it plays a huge part in us creating a chance rather than simply losing possession.

So those 2 injuries are key to the way we play, that's without even factoring the loss of Bamford's goals from last season. Llorente returning from injury has at least made us more secure at the back. Get Bamford and Ayling back as well and I think most of the other problems simply go away as a result.

Yes we should have strengthened, a central midfielder wouldn't have gone amiss but if we'd have less key injuries I don't think that would have been being used as another stick to beat Bielsa with.

[mentalcase]

More fool Bielsa really, I mean, he's lauded (by some) as one of the top coaches in the world, not West Yorkshire, but the world we're talking about here.
He's been out thought by more tactically aware and astute managers in Dyche & Potter not just Klopp & Solskear.
Can't blame that on a small squad nor injuries, that is firmly down to the boss.

[1964white]

I will just point out the square pegs as a major issue.

I firmly believe that at the top level that is a recipe for disaster. It doesnt work long term and even the best teams struggle with it and only do it as a last resort (Man City had Fernandinho playing cb for a while few seasons back and it didnt work)

Bielsa does it as a choice even when it isnt entirely forced.

It reached ludicrous levels yesterday.

So we had

Winger Dan james playing as a striker

We had striker Rodrigo playing as a central midfielder.

We had holding midfielder Adam Forshaw (he definitely is check his career stats the man hasnt a creative or goalscoring bone in his body) playing box to box midfield and was even at times our furthest forward player

We had Holding midfielder Kalvin Phillips playing centre back.

We had Central defender Diego Llorente playing right back at times (as did KP).

We had centre midfielder Jamie Shackleton playing right back.

We had winger Stuart Dallas playing full back/centre midfield.

Its ludicrous and whats worse is many of those changes werent forced, they were choices made by Bielsa.

We know Bielsa feels the system is king and players should be interchangeable but at the top level when man to man you are generally ourmatched talent wise all over the pitch it is asking for trouble.

Players have specialist positions for a reason, you dont see Klopp playing Henderson right wing for a reason, you dont see Van Dijk in the holding role for a reason, you dont see Rodri playing right back for a reason.

Even the best players would struggle out of their natural role against opponents who are their equal or who are even inferior, for our players against superior individuals being allowed to play their specialist role its like asking our players to play on ine foot, its a total hindering factor.

So for me i think one of our major issues is MB's square peg policy.

Ive never been keen but it has reached ludicrous levels like yesterday.

Injuries havent helped but he could have easily made it less daft yesterday.

Gelhardt to the striker role, James to the wing role, drop Harrison for Raph and Rodders for Klich.

Their is a stubborn side to Bielsa, i do wonder as more pressure comes will we see him do this sort of thing more and more?

We know he doesnt like to be questioned so the more he is questioned he may double down.

But yea for me this Square peg thing is beyond a joke now an it has reached ludicrous levels.

And id go as far as to say that his belief in the system over the individual is an active hinderence now as it causes him to make ludicrous selections that make no sense.

Shocking!

Is it any wonder why there isn't any continuity in our play

[1964white]

Injuries for the main part, We've had 4-6 starters out virtually all season and the re-jigs are killing us. We're a 10-16 quality team which is a massive improvement on the lower mid Championship team when MB joined.... There's a grass is greener jealousy from our fans too but I doubt that manifests itself at grounds. Not sure how hard it is for footballers to ban themselves from the internet though, most have twitter accounts it seems.

Our fans are magnificent home & away, always supportive of LUFC singing their hearts out as they have done all season, however I haven't come across a single fan who are not concerned about our form & league position.

Many fans think our poor performances lies deeper than just our injuries!

[1964white]

Their is one more factor thay hasn't been mentioned.

Fans being back.

The most successful periods in this teams time has been behind closed doors.

Maybe that plays a part?

Not having that Cjay, our fans have been brilliant, they never stopped singing yesterday even though we were poor.

Our support are playing their part, it's Bielsa & the players who are screwing up!

[1964white]

I think the choice to play James in the number 9 role yesterday is a perfect example of what’s going wrong. Gelhardt must be as baffled as we are. Strange decisions like this must affect the players, and not in a good way.

It also seems to me the players are losing faith in the system. It feels that the team togetherness has been lost.

I obviously hope we get back to last seasons levels but I can’t see it happening. Maybe we just need a couple of wins on the bounce to lose the fear factor we seem to have at the moment.

I feel sorry for young Joe & Pascal, they didn't deserve that treatment from their boss.

I've been in management all my life, I'd have never treated my staff with such contempt.

[1964white]

Not only that, he bigged Gelhardt up in the press conference and then drops him and as you point out, he doesn't get a single minute on the pitch.
That to me was the most baffling thing yesterday.

Unbelievable!

No starting No.9 with two strikers on the bench, makes no sense whatsoever!

[1964white]

In my opinion its all down to the small squad of players that are out of position and expected to go up against opposition that have quality players. Key areas have not been covered sufficiently and this has hurt our overall game. Its no use having 70% of the play if you can't get a shot on target. I expect MB will continue to the end on this season and Leeds to finish in the bottom half of the table.

Excellent debut post

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[Johnboy1965]

Square pegs in round holes and lack of investment in the summer are the main factors in our poor start.
You can hardly blame injuries when you insist on having such a small group to choose from.
Injuries are part and parcel of football and we should have invested better.

[Mick Jones shoulder]

All decent sides add quality in the off season and have done so for years. We added clowns along with playing players out position it's not complicated.
Bielsa is making it difficult ,simple.

[1964white]

All decent sides add quality in the off season and have done so for years. We added clowns along with playing players out position it's not complicated.
Bielsa is making it difficult ,simple.

Yes MJ, football is a simple game made complex by Bielsa.

[Overman]

What's gone wrong? Bielsa's gone wrong.