Mays Deal - Remain - Leave (no deal)

[Doire_Boi]

Living in the north of Ireland it's getting pretty frustrating that England can't sort out our future. We need to keep our border open and me personally would take Mays deal. It delivers brexit but keeps us within both jurisdictions. The people here voted to remain so I think that should be considered - I know scotland did too but we have really sensitive issues with borders here. A girl was shot dead during rioting just up the street from me a few weeks back and I genuinely believe the men with the balaclavas will be back if a border goes up.

Just wanted to know what you guys think on this.

Taking my mind off Frank Lampard for a while.

[Sara]

Don't know enough about the NI situation to comment specifically, but the main concern for me is the democratic process. The ordinary population is rapidly losing any leverage over the way we are governed, both with the corporate and banking influence over the unaccountable EU system, and now Parliament effectively overriding the biggest democratic mandate in history.

If we don't leave the EU, the last pretence to democracy in this country has gone imo.

[SG90]

Wasting money on something we didn't need because of a few arrogant rah rahs having a squabble. And now they have no clue what they're doing and arrogantly think we can leave without a deal. Smacks of us sucking up to the Yanks and being under their control if I'm honest. That's what UKIP and the Tories want. Oh and a privatised NHS.

[Doire_Boi]

Don't know enough about the NI situation to comment specifically, but the main concern for me is the democratic process. The ordinary population is rapidly losing any leverage over the way we are governed, both with the corporate and banking influence over the unaccountable EU system, and now Parliament effectively overriding the biggest democratic mandate in history.

If we don't leave the EU, the last pretence to democracy in this country has gone imo.

IMO most people voting at that stage didn't know how serious this would be. Now that we know how much of a dent our economny is going to take I think a revote would see remain win comfortably.

The EU are going to give us a horrid time when we do leave just to make an example of us so that nobody else leaves either.

I honestly believe Jeremy knows Mays deal is probably the best we can get and he won't agree to it because he just wants a general election.

[Mrs64]

Don't know enough about the NI situation to comment specifically, but the main concern for me is the democratic process. The ordinary population is rapidly losing any leverage over the way we are governed, both with the corporate and banking influence over the unaccountable EU system, and now Parliament effectively overriding the biggest democratic mandate in history.

If we don't leave the EU, the last pretence to democracy in this country has gone imo.

Agree with you entirely Sara

[liggy]

I don't think anyone should vote on this thread

You could undermine the result

[Doire_Boi]

I don't think anyone should vote on this thread

You could undermine the result

Are we undermining democracy

[1964white]

I honestly believe Jeremy knows Mays deal is probably the best we can get and he won't agree to it because he just wants a general election.

This arrogant man thinking about his own personal power rather than the country's needs & democracy

[SG90]

All I know is the Tories being in complete control is terrifying, especially with Johnson and Rees-Mogg running things.

[1964white]

Are we undermining democracy

One thing is for certain if democracy is overturned I will NEVER vote again in my lifetime

What's the point ?

[Sara]

IMO most people voting at that stage didn't know how serious this would be. Now that we know how much of a dent our economny is going to take I think a revote would see remain win comfortably.

The EU are going to give us a horrid time when we do leave just to make an example of us so that nobody else leaves either.

This is the argument of the establishment elite, that ordinary people are too thick to understand what they are voting for, so their opinions are worthless. We had 40 years to make our minds up about the EU, and waited as long to actually get a vote on the direction in which it was heading.

The majority of the arguments have been around short term economic forecasts, which is a distraction from the real issue of democratic sovereignty. I'm not talking about some narrow-minded nationalism, because the same problems apply equally in Europe.

There has been a systematic erosion of democratic accountability in the neoliberal era, with institutions like the EU and the State increasingly under corporate influence, to the detriment of the rights and conditions of working people. If we don't act to counter this in some way, we are in deep trouble.

Your second paragraph is simply an indictment of the power which the EU wields to counter the democratic will of sovereign states. It's hardly an argument for continuing under such a system.

[Sara]

All I know is the Tories being in complete control is terrifying, especially with Johnson and Rees-Mogg running things.

You can vote them out. Unlike the EU Commission. It's about democracy, not the policies of one party.

[Doire_Boi]

All I know is the Tories being in complete control is terrifying, especially with Johnson and Rees-Mogg running things.

Apparently Rees-Moggs "company" has thrived since the vote.

If this man ever gets in charge I'm moving to Dublin with my Irish passport

[Sara]

One thing is for certain if democracy is overturned I will NEVER vote again in my lifetime

What's the point ?

Which do you think is the most effective protest in the forthcoming EU elections (which we shouldn't even be having), not voting or voting for Farage?

[SG90]

One thing is for certain if democracy is overturned I will NEVER vote again in my lifetime

What's the point ?

It's not a democracy if their campaign was built on lies to deceive people.

[Doire_Boi]

This is the argument of the establishment elite, that ordinary people are too thick to understand what they are voting for, so their opinions are worthless. We had 40 years to make our minds up about the EU, and waited as long to actually get a vote on the direction in which it was heading.

The majority of the arguments have been around short term economic forecasts, which is a distraction from the real issue of democratic sovereignty. I'm not talking about some narrow-minded nationalism, because the same problems apply equally in Europe.

There has been a systematic erosion of democratic accountability in the neoliberal era, with institutions like the EU and the State increasingly under corporate influence, to the detriment of the rights and conditions of working people. If we don't act to counter this in some way, we are in deep trouble.

Your second paragraph is simply an indictment of the power which the EU wields to counter the democratic will of sovereign states. It's hardly an argument for continuing under such a system.

I don't know about you but I like my job and if I can give the tories any credit it would be the 3.8% unemployment rate they have achieved after a double dip recession. I would much rather continue under the current EU system than play russian roulette with peoples jobs/lives.

[SG90]

You can vote them out. Unlike the EU Commission. It's about democracy, not the policies of one party.

What are your thoughts on the royal family out of interest?

[Doire_Boi]

It's not a democracy if their campaign was built on lies to deceive people.

100%

Every single sector of our economy will suffer for at least a decade if we have a no deal - but boris knows better than the bank of england and farmers union. Whatever money we save from our EU annual bill will not be going to the NHS

[liggy]

All I can say from a labour area

For as long as tom can tell

Brexit party will cake wall it around here
Anyhoo I'm off on the hoy

[Sara]

What are your thoughts on the royal family out of interest?

They should be removed, along with the unelected second house.