Charlton Athletic v Leeds Utd Match Thread - Costa to make first league start

[MightyWhites]

Even MB must be very worried now with the lack of goals scored from the possession we have but I think this is exactly where his game-plan fails... possession football is fine if you're City or Liverpool who have the quality and clever thinking players making the right decisions during the game and converting a reasonable number of chances but he is working with bang average players who just only now and then all click together and look world-beaters but are so inconsistent that to do this over a long hard season is virtually impossible especially with no great depth within the squad. This 'system' works great up to the final 3rd most of the time and Leeds make a fine fist of it but it just doesn't happen in & around the area because of our lack of quality and every team knows how to stifle us. I think we push up far too much which condenses the play into too small an area so it all becomes frantic and this plays into the hands of the opposition ie, 11 behind the ball in defence. Surely by dropping back a bit towards our own goal it will create mqore room in the middle and spread their players out more which allows us more time on the ball however I do think that unless the forwards start knocking them in MB can adopt any system he likes the result will be no different.

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I agree with every single word of that

[Chilli D]

I thought I would wait until the dust has settled before posting about yesterday's game.
It seems our performance has really split people's opinions, some saying we played well, others saying we were awful.
I didn't see the game, only the goal, but I suspect the truth is somewhere in between.
I was watching Gillette Soccer Special and Bianca Westwood was the reporter at the game and according to her we totally bossesd the first half and only their keeper kept them in it. The second half, according to her was more even.
I am going to watch Sky's 15 minute highlights later so will reserve judgement until then.
Despite recent results I still think we are more than capable of finishing top 2.
We are having no luck at the moment and every goal we have conceded has been really soft.
I don't deny our poor finishing is a worry but all teams go through it and there's no reason why we can't start scoring freely again.
Bamford more than any really needs a goal.
Let's hope we can put one over on West Brom on Tuesday. One win is all it needs to turn things around.

[Norm]

Agree with that Chilli_D - we could beat WBA like we did last season, or maybe not.

Fingers crossed folks

[1964white]

I am going to watch Sky's 15 minute highlights later so will reserve judgement until then.

Chilli with all due respect you can't judge a game on 15 minutes of highlights

Truth is we huffed & puffed & made hard work of it playing against a ex-League One side who have nowhere near the same quality of our team. It was like last seasons QPR/Birmingham/Ipswich defeats, games we should have been winning but we lacked the nous & bottle to win those games just as we did yesterday.

[1964white]

The Charlton fans I went with yesterday both at the game and in the pub were all pretty much of the same view.
Leeds were the best footballing team they'd played but were Arsenal, under Wenger in disguise in that we always want to seem to walk the ball into the net and don't shoot and never really look threatening beyond the final third

They are spot on

IMO White was our clear MOTM.

Bang on you are correct Cat

Costa was useless. Bamford and Harrison - the same seemingly week on week. No end product.

Once again spot on, a strike-force that can't score

As they told me Charlton fans did not expect to win that game

You should have told them this is Leeds you are playing who are always likely to c**k-up at any given moment

[Chilli D]

Chilli with all due respect you can't judge a game on 15 minutes of highlights

Truth is we huffed & puffed & made hard work of it playing against a ex-League One side who have nowhere near the same quality of our team. It was like last seasons QPR/Birmingham/Ipswich defeats, games we should have been winning but we lacked the nous & bottle to win those games just as we did yesterday.

64 with respect to you, no I can't judge what happened over 90 minutes because I didn't see the game which i said in my original post but what I did see in those highlights was them only have one chance which they scored.
We had at least six, possibly more, good chances and didn't take any of them.
As I also said, the lack of goals recently is a bit worrying but there's no reason we can't start scoring freely again.
Please respect my opinion regardless of whether you agree with it or not, I can only base it on what I see, live or otherwise.

[1964white]

64 with respect to you, no I can't judge what happened over 90 minutes because I didn't see the game which i said in my original post but what I did see in those highlights was them only have one chance which they scored.
We had at least six, possibly more, good chances and didn't take any of them.
As I also said, the lack of goals recently is a bit worrying but there's no reason we can't start scoring freely again.
Please respect my opinion regardless of whether you agree with it or not, I can only base it on what I see, live or otherwise.

I do Chilli

You are right Charlton only had one chance which was a bit of calamity on our part & a fluke goal for the Addicks.

The lack of goals you mentioned last week is indeed a major concern something we have to address quickly, hopefully over our next two games

[Oscar]

First post in a while just had a mad busy last couple of months but should hopefully be able to post regularly again

One of our poorest displays under Bielsa just everything was wrong about yesterday:
1. The performance yes we started the game quite well but I genuinely can't think of us creating any big chances or seriously testing the Charlton backline and in the second half we just ran out of ideas.
2. The selection of Shackleton over Forshaw or Roberts, Shackleton has got loads of potential but isn't ready to start games for us imo and i'm not convinced CM is his best position.
3. The substitutions- the change to 3-5-2 was unnecessary we just looked totally unbalanced and made the wrong changes to allow that system to work anyway imo. Harrison at LWB? when some of Alioski's best performances have come from that position and i'm by no means an Alioksi fan. A back 3 as well of White, Phillips, Cooper made me a bit nervous just always feel when you change to a back 3 it's crucial you have a full back in the 3 who is comfortable defending the wide areas especially with how far we push the wing backs forward, Berra should have come on. Charlton had they been braver on the counter attack could have easily got another goal with the spaces we left. Then Costa in the 10 role? Forshaw coming on who hasn't scored in 3 years coming on before Roberts in the middle despite being a goal behind?
We had controlled large periods of the first half just needed to make some attacking changes within the 4-1-4-1 shape to allow us to look more dangerous in the final 3rd. Roberts for Shackleton, Clarke for Harrison and Eddie for Bamford.

Player Ratings:
Casilla 4/10 awful awful piece of goalkeeping, making far too many errors considering how few shots he has to face thanks to the impact of Ben White
Dallas 7/10 another solid display got forward well tried to make things happen and didn't put a foot wrong defensively although was a little disappointed he wasn't more involved when he went to RWB in the second half.
White 6/10 as much as I praised him before he was partly to blame for the goal lost his marker (although recovered his run and very nearly got a block on the initial shot) again a solid performance and good on the ball again.
Cooper 7/10 solid display and complements White well.
Alioski 7/10 thought he played well provided plenty of energy and did little wrong defensively.
Phillips 5/10 when KP switched to CB he really struggled some woeful passing on a rare off day for Kalvin.
Costa 5/10 showed some lovely touches and turns at times but didn't have any impact on the game and hardly noticed Costa in the second half.
Shackleton 6/10 battled in the middle but has the lost the ball too easily in the middle too often during his run of games here.
Klich 6/10 started the game really well and found his range of passing including two wonderful passes into the final third that should have led to more. Very quiet second half, however.
Harrison 6/10 worked hard but just wasted so many crossing opportunities, far too often looked for the easy pass
Bamford 4/10 poor display far too easy for the centre backs and should have been sent off for his challenge in the second half. Defended Bamford all season but can't defend yesterday it was like a Bamford performance from the end of last season.
Substitutions:
Forshaw 6/10 tried to get on the ball but didn't really change much in the game.
Nketiah 5/10 a few half chances but never really got going.
Roberts 5/10 too big an ask putting Roberts on with 20 minutes to go expecting him to change a game when we were struggling to pass the ball 10 yards all the momentum had gone.

Just don't feel we are at the levels of last season going forward or performance wise and too many players are not showing up or at their levels from last season.

[1964white]

First post in a while just had a mad busy last couple of months but should hopefully be able to post regularly again

One of our poorest displays under Bielsa just everything was wrong about yesterday:
1. The performance yes we started the game quite well but I genuinely can't think of us creating any big chances or seriously testing the Charlton backline and in the second half we just ran out of ideas.
2. The selection of Shackleton over Forshaw or Roberts, Shackleton has got loads of potential but isn't ready to start games for us imo and i'm not convinced CM is his best position.
3. The substitutions- the change to 3-5-2 was unnecessary we just looked totally unbalanced and made the wrong changes to allow that system to work anyway imo. Harrison at LWB? when some of Alioski's best performances have come from that position and i'm by no means an Alioksi fan. A back 3 as well of White, Phillips, Cooper made me a bit nervous just always feel when you change to a back 3 it's crucial you have a full back in the 3 who is comfortable defending the wide areas especially with how far we push the wing backs forward, Berra should have come on. Charlton had they been braver on the counter attack could have easily got another goal with the spaces we left. Then Costa in the 10 role? Forshaw coming on who hasn't scored in 3 years coming on before Roberts in the middle despite being a goal behind?
We had controlled large periods of the first half just needed to make some attacking changes within the 4-1-4-1 shape to allow us to look more dangerous in the final 3rd. Roberts for Shackleton, Clarke for Harrison and Eddie for Bamford.

Player Ratings:
Casilla 4/10 awful awful piece of goalkeeping, making far too many errors considering how few shots he has to face thanks to the impact of Ben White
Dallas 7/10 another solid display got forward well tried to make things happen and didn't put a foot wrong defensively although was a little disappointed he wasn't more involved when he went to RWB in the second half.
White 6/10 as much as I praised him before he was partly to blame for the goal lost his marker (although recovered his run and very nearly got a block on the initial shot) again a solid performance and good on the ball again.
Cooper 7/10 solid display and complements White well.
Alioski 7/10 thought he played well provided plenty of energy and did little wrong defensively.
Phillips 5/10 when KP switched to CB he really struggled some woeful passing on a rare off day for Kalvin.
Costa 5/10 showed some lovely touches and turns at times but didn't have any impact on the game and hardly noticed Costa in the second half.
Shackleton 6/10 battled in the middle but has the lost the ball too easily in the middle too often during his run of games here.
Klich 6/10 started the game really well and found his range of passing including two wonderful passes into the final third that should have led to more. Very quiet second half, however.
Harrison 6/10 worked hard but just wasted so many crossing opportunities, far too often looked for the easy pass
Bamford 4/10 poor display far too easy for the centre backs and should have been sent off for his challenge in the second half. Defended Bamford all season but can't defend yesterday it was like a Bamford performance from the end of last season.
Substitutions:
Forshaw 6/10 tried to get on the ball but didn't really change much in the game.
Nketiah 5/10 a few half chances but never really got going.
Roberts 5/10 too big an ask putting Roberts on with 20 minutes to go expecting him to change a game when we were struggling to pass the ball 10 yards all the momentum had gone.

Just don't feel we are at the levels of last season going forward or performance wise and too many players are not showing up or at their levels from last season.

We got very little right on the day, good to see you back on MOT Oscar

[YorkshireSquare]

First post in a while just had a mad busy last couple of months but should hopefully be able to post regularly again

Good to see you back Oscar

[Cjay]

Still havent conceded a goal with Ali as left back from open play.

Dallas has played left back before and was dire (aside from 1 game )

Watched the goal back and couldn't help but notice both cbs were poor.

Ben White lost his man at the set piece, a cardinal sin for any cb.

And Cooper has his arms all over his man, if ever we get promoted and Cooper is 1st choice he will concede a pen every game.

Its very poor and the sign of a limited cb imo.

[1964white]

Still havent conceded a goal with Ali as left back from open play.

Ali often gets caught out of position with Cooper, White & Phillips often covering his hide as was the case when Douglas & Alioski were caught far too up field for Derby's 92nd minute equaliser, neither of them nowhere to be seen. Ali for is energy is much better than the lethargic Douglas but he is far from being a steady defender

[Cjay]

Ali often gets caught out of position with Cooper, White & Phillips often covering his hide as was the case when Douglas & Alioski were caught far too up field for Derby's 92nd minute equaliser, neither of them nowhere to be seen. Ali for is energy is much better than the lethargic Douglas but he is far from being a steady defender

Douglas & Alioski were both culpable for Bristol City's goal. Davis showed both them how to defend when he came on to steady the ship in the final minutes

Ali wasnt on the pitch when Bristol City scored, Douglas had replaced him, in the highlights you can clearly see Douglas and Harrison, Ali had gone off.

Sorry but you cant blame Ali for the Derby goal. Derby break, Phillips is attracted to the man with the ball and leaves his man to go to the ball. The player with the ball then passes to the player Phillips left. Phillips tracks the runner who had the ball but that player stops and Phillips has no idea where he has gone. This then allows the player Phillips was meant to be marking in the first place to play it back to the full back who plays a 1-2 with the player who Phillips went to mark in the first phase but has now lost and the full back runs off Douglas who as usual only jogs to get back.

Ali cant be blamed for any of that as he is now the winger and had Phillips not lost his man not once but twice this whole situation would have been avoided.

Ali is the best left back we have by a distance, if he does get caught out of position on occasion it is because of Bielsa and his teammates.

MB wants his full backs to push on, if they get caught out of position its likely because of poor play further up the field that allows a break imo.

Either way i can defend Ali on both examples

Know you dont like him but bit harsh to blame him for a goal he was sat on the bench for.

[1964white]

Know you dont like him but bit harsh to blame him for a goal he was sat on the bench for.

Not that I don't like him, just think he is hugely overrated. Can't fault his energy & effort & had a decent 2018/19 season

You've probably never seen a decent Leeds left-back Cjay

[whiteswan]

Only just brought myself to watch the goal....not having a go at all, but could Kiko have caught the ball

[1964white]

Only just brought myself to watch the goal....not having a go at all, but could Kiko have caught the ball

Even though I'm a Kiko fan I think he should have done better Swannie

[whiteswan]

Even though I'm a Kiko fan I think he should have done better Swannie

I have to say that Kiko has grown on me this season but he is still prone to doing the odd silly thing....which can, could and has cost us points....

[Cjay]

You've probably never seen a decent Leeds left-back Cjay

Well i have . . . . . . .

But aside from that, now you mention it.

First season i remember was 1997/1998, Ian Harte was in the team but dont think he was 1st choice yet, think that came next season.

Harte was basically a good Douglas, not the best defender, not the worst but set pieces were great.

Then there was Frazer Richardson i think and Stephen Crainey who were both pretty dire.

Dan Harding, Danny Pugh, Ben Parker, Alan Sheehan, Jamie Clapham.

Andy Hughes played a bit to i think, not the best but gave his all.

Aidy White was ok briefly.

George McCartney, Bessone.

But then Charlie Taylor who was very good, loved Charlie.

So Ali, Taylor and Hartey.

On another note, i recommend never thinking back because when you remember some of the shite we have had wear our shirt it makes you want to cry

[1964white]

Well i have . . . . . . .

But aside from that, now you mention it.

First season i remember was 1997/1998, Ian Harte was in the team but dont think he was 1st choice yet, think that came next season.

Harte was basically a good Douglas, not the best defender, not the worst but set pieces were great.

Then there was Frazer Richardson i think and Stephen Crainey who were both pretty dire.

Dan Harding, Danny Pugh, Ben Parker, Alan Sheehan, Jamie Clapham.

Andy Hughes played a bit to i think, not the best but gave his all.

Aidy White was ok briefly.

George McCartney, Bessone.

But then Charlie Taylor who was very good, loved Charlie.

So Ali, Taylor and Hartey.

On another note, i recommend never thinking back because when you remember some of the shite we have had wear our short it makes you want to cry

My god there is some on that list

Charlie Taylor was a good defender, shame about his attitude. Ali beats CT hands down on that point

[Sara]

Only just brought myself to watch the goal....not having a go at all, but could Kiko have caught the ball

Not if he was preparing to dive to save a header.