To Panic Or Not To Panic

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Cjay
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Cjay »

Genghers wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:39 pm OR the interest was real, but they were demanding excessive wages that we weren't prepared to spend.

Vydra on £50k/w isn't worth it, even if he was top scorer last season (with the lowest total since 2009...). Hernandez has just failed a medical at CSKA Moscow and they were going to ask him to lower his wage demands anyway.

How many people buy season tickets based on signings? Agree that Kinnear's exciting summer comments seem premature now and you shouldn't go making those promises, but I don't think there was any devious intent there.
But the club should have known that they would demand high wages.

Hernandez wanted 70k off Villa in 2016 he was always going to demand a huge signing on fee and wages.

Vydra apparently didnt want to join, thats reflected in his wage demands, if he wasnt keen he isnt going to change his mind, why does it take a month to come to that conclusion?

It would seem odd for the leagues top scorer to go to a lower placed league club without a huge wage increase.

Naive of LUFC to expect anything different, those 2 were never likely to be bowled over by Bielsa and Leeds, cold hard cash would always be the reason.

Hope you're right regarding Kinnear but there was a lot of spin, even when Bielsa arrived we were told that "transfers were very advanced".

If thats the case who was that with?

Will wait and see and hope.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Cjay »

Brader wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:10 pm Because he went to Swansea on wages we couldn’t offer.
Couldn't or wouldn't?

I cant see his wage demands being massive, probably pretty reasonable.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Genghers »

But perhaps the club thought they could negotiate those wages, or add incentives to bring down the basic wage.

Vydra changed his demands from what we've heard - doesn't look good in the first place. Then we still went back.

I'm sure we offered him an improvement on his current wage and even if he was top scorer at a team that finished higher than us, he clearly isn't wanted by them...
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Brader »

Regardless I’m not too fussed by vydra - he had a shitty attitude and there’s big doubts over his fitness - here’s hoping he has a s**t season and we finish above derby
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by weasel »

Cjay wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:10 pm Something that seems odd to me, bit worrying even.

We wanted a winger, we got one, a very highly rated but unproven loan from Manchester City, fair enough, cheap and risk free.

But if we wanted a winger and we spoke to Manchester City.

Why didnt we go for the City winger available for 4mil who got 7 goals in 23 games including a screamer against us for Ipswich last season?

Bersant Celina seems perfect for us and is proven good in the Championship.
All depends on how you look at things. Man City were happy to sell Celina, they didn't want to sell Harrison - that suggests to me that City rate Harrison higher.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by weasel »

I don't really get all the panic, sure we could have signed a couple more players but so far I see lots of reasons to be cheerful all depends on how you look at things.

Whilst we haven't signed another centreback we also (at present) have not sold PJ. It would have been very easy for PJ to have left this summer and it would have been highly unlikely we would have been able to sign anyone of his quality.

We haven't sold any first team regulars - RV looks like he is leaving which is a big shame but we are still waiting for him to string a good run of performances together and it was looking doubtful he would be a first team starter.

So we haven't in any way weakened the first team - contrast that to seasons gone by where we have twice lost the league's top scorer (Ross McCormack and Chris Wood) and also seen our best players continually leaving. What we have done though is to get rid of a lot of dead wood and get some of our potential players of the future out on loan. We have also strengthened an area that was incredibly weak last season by signing arguably the best left back in the division last year. We have potentially upgraded the goalkeeper situation too. We have strengthened the midfield with the loans of Baker and Harrison, both with good youth pedigree and both highly though of by their parent clubs. We also seem to have got Klich firing on all cylinders and looking like he could be a very good player. Up front it looks like we are strengthening with the signing of Bamford and we also have Tyler Roberts hopefully fully fit and raring to go. Whilst it may seem like Bamford wasn't our first choice we could easily have spent a lot on Abel Hernande only to see him injured all season and it seems that Vydra has kept upping his wage demands after seemingly agreeing - seems more like he was only interested in money.

Yes I still feel we are a centreback short but apart from that we look to have a fairly decent, and balanced squad and we may still be looking to sign one given the number 5 shirt is still available.So far all our signings, barring Blackman, came completely out of the blue so we may still have 1 or 2 more players still to come in.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by John in Louisiana »

weasel wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:26 pm I don't really get all the panic, sure we could have signed a couple more players but so far I see lots of reasons to be cheerful all depends on how you look at things.

Whilst we haven't signed another centreback we also (at present) have not sold PJ. It would have been very easy for PJ to have left this summer and it would have been highly unlikely we would have been able to sign anyone of his quality.

We haven't sold any first team regulars - RV looks like he is leaving which is a big shame but we are still waiting for him to string a good run of performances together and it was looking doubtful he would be a first team starter.

So we haven't in any way weakened the first team - contrast that to seasons gone by where we have twice lost the league's top scorer (Ross McCormack and Chris Wood) and also seen our best players continually leaving. What we have done though is to get rid of a lot of dead wood and get some of our potential players of the future out on loan. We have also strengthened an area that was incredibly weak last season by signing arguably the best left back in the division last year. We have potentially upgraded the goalkeeper situation too. We have strengthened the midfield with the loans of Baker and Harrison, both with good youth pedigree and both highly though of by their parent clubs. We also seem to have got Klich firing on all cylinders and looking like he could be a very good player. Up front it looks like we are strengthening with the signing of Bamford and we also have Tyler Roberts hopefully fully fit and raring to go. Whilst it may seem like Bamford wasn't our first choice we could easily have spent a lot on Abel Hernande only to see him injured all season and it seems that Vydra has kept upping his wage demands after seemingly agreeing - seems more like he was only interested in money.

Yes I still feel we are a centreback short but apart from that we look to have a fairly decent, and balanced squad and we may still be looking to sign one given the number 5 shirt is still available.So far all our signings, barring Blackman, came completely out of the blue so we may still have 1 or 2 more players still to come in.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Genghers »

weasel wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:26 pm So we haven't in any way weakened the first team - contrast that to seasons gone by where we have twice lost the league's top scorer (Ross McCormack and Chris Wood) and also seen our best players continually leaving.
I do agree with your post, but just to play devil's advocate...

We haven't weakened the starting 11 - the addition of Douglas should definitely improve it, given that we didn't have a specialist left back until the end of the season and that was Pearce.

BUT other than that we're looking at a starting 11 vs. Stoke of which 10 players were at the club last term and finished mid-table. There's probably a reason we've not lost our best players from last season - we didn't rally have one!

We're probably short a CB as you say, but as it stands we only have Roberts and Roofe as strikers, neither of whom are big lads who can impose themselves on defenders and make space for our more attacking midfielders...

Vieira wouldn't be a starter, but if he does move away then it's one of the better youth prospects we've seen in a while leave us. Probably not on the same level as Cook was when he left, but a similar blow.

I'm not convinced that we can loan our way to promotion. If you look at some of the better loan signings last season, they were more established players who were out of favour at their clubs/had decent loan fees attached (e.g. Mitrovic at Fulham).
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by Cjay »

weasel wrote: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:07 pm All depends on how you look at things. Man City were happy to sell Celina, they didn't want to sell Harrison - that suggests to me that City rate Harrison higher.
In which case we are developing there player for them having not inserted a buying clause.
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Re: To Panic Or Not To Panic

Post by NorfolkWhite »

Genghers wrote: Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:09 am I do agree with your post, but just to play devil's advocate...

We haven't weakened the starting 11 - the addition of Douglas should definitely improve it, given that we didn't have a specialist left back until the end of the season and that was Pearce.

BUT other than that we're looking at a starting 11 vs. Stoke of which 10 players were at the club last term and finished mid-table. There's probably a reason we've not lost our best players from last season - we didn't rally have one!

We're probably short a CB as you say, but as it stands we only have Roberts and Roofe as strikers, neither of whom are big lads who can impose themselves on defenders and make space for our more attacking midfielders...

Vieira wouldn't be a starter, but if he does move away then it's one of the better youth prospects we've seen in a while leave us. Probably not on the same level as Cook was when he left, but a similar blow.

I'm not convinced that we can loan our way to promotion. If you look at some of the better loan signings last season, they were more established players who were out of favour at their clubs/had decent loan fees attached (e.g. Mitrovic at Fulham).
I'm on this side of the fence. So far the only areas we have strengthened over last season are LB, great signing, and I would say GK over what we had for most of the season. All other areas we are hoping that MB has improved / organises better what we already had. There seems to be a lot of expectation over Klich this year, whilst he has done well in pre-season and I understand all the positive comments I'm a little less confident he will carry this over into the Championship, seems neat and tidy on the ball but just worry about whether he can cope with the pace and intensity. Stoke as first game is a bad one for us I fear, they will be strong, physical and the exact opposite of what we will be about. I can see us getting steam-rollered quite badly in this one :( Hope I'm wrong but I don't see us finishing any higher than last year.
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