Orta's babes

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Cjay
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Orta's babes

Post by Cjay » Tue Mar 20, 2018 2:50 pm

If you want to watch a Leeds team that play good football, not hoofball, slick, along the ground, passing from the back, with purpose and precision, then watch the u23s and u18s.

Things didnt start well, but in recent months things have started to look up.

1 loss in 10 between them, lots of goals and solid defending.

Despite the criticism of Orta and his 1st team recruits his youth team recruits have been earning rave reviews.

Oriol Rey, Jack Clarke, Kun Temenzhukov, Sam Dalby, Ryan Edmondson, Alejandro Machuca, Pascal Struijk, Jay Roy Grot all have earned much praise recently.

Orta deserves credit for this, as does the coach, Carlos Corberan, who was once recommended for a job apparently by none other then Pep Guardiola.

A difficult start for Carlos, but now we are seeing his work paying off, he has got the youth sides, with help from his coaches, playing a style of football thats pleasing on the eye and successful. Takes time to change a teams playing style, something Radz lacked patience with for the 1st team.

Credit where credit is due to all involved.

But could this be where Paul Heckingbottom gains favour with his bosses and the fans?

If Hecky was to start leaving out Eunan O'Kane, Hadi Sacko, Stuart Dallas, Kalvin Phillips, Matty Pennington, Vurnon Anita, players who have maybe not impressed as much as they should given the chances they have had.

And he starts playing some of the lads mentioned above, Oriol Rey for O'Kane, Jack Clarke for Hadi Sacko etc.

Maybe he talks to Carlos, adapts the playing style that he uses and that TC aimed for.

If the fans see a return to the style of football under TC, and Hecky shows even more willingness to give youngsters a chance instead of the same old faces, could this be his ticket to staying at Elland Road beyond this summer?

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weasel
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Re: Orta's babes

Post by weasel » Tue Mar 20, 2018 3:08 pm

The only trouble you have there is that the manager has no real knowledge of how to use these style of tactics he is the hoofball and pick up the scraps, win the second ball, work hard off the ball etc type manager. It would be like putting Tony Pulis in charge of Man City it just wouldn't bring out the best in the players (despite Pulis being an excellent manager at playing the way he does).

It is similar in a way to when England appointed Graham Taylor as England Manager. Taylor had been a successful manager of club sides playing long ball tactics extremely well. However in charge of England there was no way he could run the international side as a long ball side so you had a decent manager with decent players but totally unsuited to working with each other. Whereas across the water in Ireland Jack Charlton was allowed to manager the Republic of Ireland how he wanted, he could play long balls and he had great success working with players that were nowhere near as good individually as the English players.

If we are to fully benefit from the youth potential we need a coach that knows how to play this way which is why TC was a good choice, despite many people questioning his managerial background, as he had been around the Barcelona system as a youngster and player and seen the tactics and way of playing.
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Re: Orta's babes

Post by faaip » Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:28 pm

I thought we played the ball to feet well a lot of the time v SW, less smack it and hope which is pointless with Ekuban anyway. Plus a very nicely worked FK which deserved a goal. Not sure we can say with absolute conviction we play hoofball in general in the first team ..
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Re: Orta's babes

Post by 1964white » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:21 pm

faaip wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:28 pm
I thought we played the ball to feet well a lot of the time v SW, less smack it and hope which is pointless with Ekuban anyway. Plus a very nicely worked FK which deserved a goal. Not sure we can say with absolute conviction we play hoofball in general in the first team ..
We did mate :tup:

Anybody who thought we played hoofball were watching a different game to you & I :roll:

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by Cjay » Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:56 pm

66 long balls out of 400 or so passes vs Reading, similar vs Wednesday,

Hecky always has the goalkeeper kick long, hoof towards the striker, battle for second balls, thats his old fashioned mentality.

Dont trust stats, thats fine, go ask the Barnsley fans, blaming the players (yep), tactically stunted (yep), strange subs (yep) long ball tactics (yep).

I agree to an extent it was less direct slightly against Wednesday, but only slightly.

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by weasel » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:57 pm

Cjay wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:56 pm
I agree to an extent it was less direct slightly against Wednesday, but only slightly.
Probably the only reason for that was we were lacking Cooper with his long raking hoofballs and his replacement Pennington didn't have the strength to be able to kick it hard enough for it to be classed as a long ball.
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Re: Orta's babes

Post by Cjay » Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:42 pm

weasel wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:57 pm
Probably the only reason for that was we were lacking Cooper with his long raking hoofballs and his replacement Pennington didn't have the strength to be able to kick it hard enough for it to be classed as a long ball.
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Re: Orta's babes

Post by Shields53 » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:10 pm

1964white wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:21 pm
We did mate :tup:

Anybody who thought we played hoofball were watching a different game to you & I :roll:
We sounded the better team for large parts of that game, the mentality just isnt there to keep that clean sheet and not throw things away. :roll:

Talking to a Barnsley fan today he has the same complaint about their team. They are playing boring longball football now whereas at least under Heck they were trying to play nice football.

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by 1964white » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:25 pm

Shields53 wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:10 pm
We sounded the better team for large parts of that game, the mentality just isnt there to keep that clean sheet and not throw things away. :roll:

Talking to a Barnsley fan today he has the same complaint about their team. They are playing boring longball football now whereas at least under Heck they were trying to play nice football.
The Barnsley fan is right, Heck has tried to instil us to play football on the ground

I don't get where all this hoof stuff is coming from, yes the keeper has to boot the ball up field when it's passed back to him & he is being pressed. All our back four like to play the ball on the ground, our midfield was definitely more composed on the ball influenced by the excellent Forshaw who rarely gives the ball away, both Lassoga & Ekuban prefer the ball played to feet which was the case for much of the game last Saturday. I didn't see much long-ball stuff at Reading to be honest

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by 1964white » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:39 pm

This certainly isn't hoof football 20 seconds into this clip

One of the best set-pieces I've seen from a Leeds side, if only Ekuban has slotted it in.........


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Re: Orta's babes

Post by Cjay » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:42 pm

1964white wrote:
Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:39 pm
This certainly isn't hoof football 20 seconds into this clip

One of the best set-pieces I've seen from a Leeds side, if only Ekuban has slotted it in.........

Thats Gianni Vio not Mr Bean.

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by Cjay » Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:48 pm

Imo Hecky is more hoof.

If you read Barnsley forum they mention certain things.
"12 months of awful football, negative and direct".
"Constantly telling the players there not good enough ".
"Saying we are where we deserve to be".
"Negative substitutions, always like for like".

There basically direct quotes.

If people dont think Hecky is hoofball watch the youth teams . Totally different

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Re: Orta's babes

Post by weasel » Wed Mar 21, 2018 8:28 am

I am no lawyer but suggesting that a well worked free kick on the edge of the opposition's penalty area is proof that we don't play longball - not even a Neil Warnock side would try to work it from there to a position to try a long ball.

We have gone from a longball team under Monk, where we tryed to play diagonal longballs and then pick up the pieces, to a team playing it on the floor as uch as possible under TC, including from the keeper so much so that the only criticism in the opening weeks were that we were going to play ourselves into trouble by overplaying it at the back, to a team that doesn't really know what they are trying to do under PH. As I have said before this is the stupidity of changing managers to ones with contrasting styles. A shame really as Barnsley teams in the past have at times played good football.
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